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142 Comments
- cbeach, on 10/26/2009, -17/+69Used PCs for many years. Tolerated annoyances because they seemed unlikely or difficult to get fixed. PC World and Microsoft aren't known for their support. Contrast with the Apple Store - staff there are trained well enough to help. And if they can't repair the unit they'll replace it on the spot.
Switching to Apple meant -initially- paying a premium, but my Macs have held their value. In the long run it's been cheap to upgrade them as I could sell the old unit as a whole, and get a lot for it on the 2nd hand market. The PC upgrade path, on the other hand, left a wasteful graveyard of orphaned components, and frankenstein machines that were unsaleable
When people compare Macbooks to Toshibas/HPs etc they miss the details. Things like the exceptional battery performance you get on a Mac, the truly instant on, the magnetic power attachment, the silent running, and of course the quality of OS X.
When you compare Macs to PCs you're not entirely comparing like-for-like. Try a Mac for a few days and you'll see why people pay the "Apple Tax" - kreatre2007, on 10/26/2009, -4/+41They make awesome products. Bash Apple if you want, but sales don't lie.
- killerknives, on 10/26/2009, -1/+31isn't that usually the point of charging less?
- arunforce, on 10/26/2009, -3/+29Supply and demand folks, nothing to see here.
- AngelBunny, on 10/26/2009, -0/+26Is Apple the only computer company that recommends their computers be serviced like cars are? For example, the battery on my 2007 macbook pro slowly was loosing life like most batteries do. I was down to 3 hours a charge and if I was on youtube often 2 hours a charge or so. I went in because my cd burner started failing on dl dvd-r's to get a replacement. When I went in the genius bar guy was like, "It has been a while. You should of come in for a service months ago." I was like, "huh? ..." he then plugged my laptop into some testing software and was like, "your battery seems to have gone bad. Let me replace that for you.. and while he had someone getting out the paperwork and the replacement battery he was checking my hdd for bad sectors, my graphics card for any faults, and other stuff. I then told him about my dvd burner acting up and they replaced it on the spot.
Does any other computer company 'service' their 3 year old computers and give completely free replacement parts if something acts up but is not broken? I figured I would have to go out of my way to buy a new battery when my original died like every other non Apple laptop I've ever had regardless if it was under warranty or not.
Everyone's values are different. I'm the type of person who would rather buy a Lexus than an american car just because of consumer satisfaction. Not everyone wants that and I get it. Some people like more horse power in their cars or AWD or off roading stuff. Me, I like what I buy to have a long life and great consumer satisfaction. Yes, I pay a lot for it and no I do not regret it. I do not force what I like on everyone else. Why should you guys care what products I buy and what I do in my own free time anyways? The whole argument is stupid to begin with. - cbeach, on 10/26/2009, -10/+35The anger, defensiveness and inferiority complex of PC fanboys never fails to amuse me.
And yes, I'm a smug, satisfied Mac user. - AmyVernon, on 10/25/2009, -8/+31Too true. But for all the issues family members have had with Windows-based products, I'm OK with paying a bit more for Apple and having so few problems.
- tidu, on 10/26/2009, -4/+25I wouldn't say the quality of the components is better. Better than Dell, yes, but probably on par with everything else. It's a luxury brand, you don't see people complaining about BMW do you?
- mrBitch, on 10/26/2009, -3/+24RE: " .. While I'm convinced my love for my iPhone should lead me to at least try a MacBook Pro, the HP laptop offers so much more bang for your buck. That's an Core i7, a Blu-Ray player, integrated webcam and HD TV tuner, and a 320GB 7200rpm harddrive. Other companies blow Apple out of the water concerning the price. Nonetheless, I've never heard of one Apple user who isn't completely in love with their machine. And as I stated above, if Apple puts that much love and thought into the iPhone then I may just have to see what all the hype is about. ...even at the cost of an i7 and Blue-Ray.
I compare it to cars:
The new Challenger is gorgeous. More power under the hood. More specs than you can shake a stick at. But it's large, energy-inefficient, and the company is known to have issues in around 5 years of constant use.
The Mercedes C Class is just a little higher in price. It's well-built. Maybe not as customizable or flashy, but damnit, every inch of that car is made to make the car an efficient beast. Simplicity and luxury for a long time.
In this case, the Apple is the Mercedes. And I may just have to skip out on the the vehicles I've grown up with and trade them in for vehicles that are made to last and built for driving, not looks."
As a former developer for all things Microsoft, all I can add is that since I bought a MacBook Pro, the only thing I have regretted is not trying out a MacBook earlier... - wengyang, on 10/25/2009, -15/+35
everything is based on perception. higher pricing gives out that the perception that something is higher quality - seltaeb4, on 10/26/2009, -6/+26Get the Mac. You'll never regret it.
You yourself say, "my experience with HP's isn't the most positive."
The iLife Suite (included with every Mac) is great. A big part of the Mac's appeal is how well the hardware and software work together, and this beats any laundry-list of hardware specs.
Happy computing! - tidu, on 10/26/2009, -2/+17It depends on how you use it. Obviously Macs aren't for gaming, although if you're dedicated, a windows partition and a few games isn't hard to do at all (and the hardware definitely supports games). I'd agree with you on the reliability part. I've had two major problems with my Macbook Pro since 2007, and both were fixed for free within a day or two (one under the 1 year warranty, and one was a known problem). I bought this to last through 5 years of college, and I'm starting to see my friends' Dells have more and more problems these days... happy about my purchase.
- Antialias, on 10/26/2009, -3/+17I don't think you've been following the prices then. The cheapest macbook pro used to be 1799, there is one for 1199 now. Macbook itself has stayed at $999 for a few years at least I don't recall it ever being cheaper than $999.
- MacHarborGuy, on 10/26/2009, -7/+20tech specs are not the end all be all.
- seltaeb4, on 10/26/2009, -23/+351. Try typing on a Mac for an hour or two.
2. Go back and try typing on your average PC keyboard or laptop.
3. Try and tell me that the Mac isn't of higher quality. - copywriteink, on 10/25/2009, -6/+18So am I. I started my company with a monochrome Mac Classic and never looked back. :)
- mrBitch, on 10/26/2009, -2/+14@ crole, RE: " .. I have a feeling it has more to do with your family's technical skills."
Wow, what a sell for using a Windows PC :
" You must read & complete all exercises within this 300 page manual before using this PC." - tidu, on 10/26/2009, -3/+14Now that my family has a mini, I'm happy I'm not the go-to guy to fix their problems... Yes, Macs are more restricted, but that definitely has its benefits for family members who want to do nothing more than email and surf the internet.
- streak, on 10/26/2009, -3/+12It's all possible because component prices came way down and Apple didn't panic with its own prices. Apple priced many of its items perhaps 6 months before the start of the quarter to bring in 30% profit. When component prices plummeted, as they did during the market downturn, profit margins went up big.
- imsohigh, on 10/26/2009, -5/+13I dunno... My G11 keyboard I bought for $30 feels much better than any mac keyboard I have typed on...
- mrBitch, on 10/26/2009, -7/+15@ cbeach, RE: " .. Used PCs for many years. Tolerated annoyances because they seemed unlikely or difficult to get fixed. PC World and Microsoft aren't known for their support. Contrast with the Apple Store - staff there are trained well enough to help. And if they can't repair the unit they'll replace it on the spot.
Switching to Apple meant -initially- paying a premium, but my Macs have held their value. In the long run it's been cheap to upgrade them as I could sell the old unit as a whole, and get a lot for it on the 2nd hand market. The PC upgrade path, on the other hand, left a wasteful graveyard of orphaned components, and frankenstein machines that were unsaleable
When people compare Macbooks to Toshibas/HPs etc they miss the details. Things like the exceptional battery performance you get on a Mac, the truly instant on, the magnetic power attachment, the silent running, and of course the quality of OS X.
When you compare Macs to PCs you're not entirely comparing like-for-like. Try a Mac for a few days and you'll see why people pay the "Apple Tax"
As a former developer for all things Microsoft, I agree. - quamb, on 10/26/2009, -4/+11True. It's marketing basics.
Though in most cases, there is a reason for a brand or product to be priced higher. Simply compare a $20 toaster vs a $100 toaster and it's obvious. Both make toast, but one is cheap plastic and crappy, the other, aluminum and well thought out.
And if you dupe the public, not matter what brand, the product can tank pretty quickly. Take a look how quickly Sony messed up the Playstation brand with overpricing the PS3.
Apple seemed to have found a sweet spot with their pricing and end product. And I'm sure if Dell or Hp or whoever - spent buckets of time and $$$ on R&D, cutting edge manufacturing techniques, the worlds top tier industrial designers etc, all to have a product on the market like the unibody Macbook Pro - they wouldn't be the discount products PC users boast about. - nesagwa, on 10/26/2009, -2/+9Manufacturing costs to down, profits go up.
Happens in all electronics. - buddhistMonkey, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6"75% of [Mac users] can't even use the apps - except for maybe solitaire."
Shows what you know. The only game that comes with OS X is Chess. - Kerrigore, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6I sell computers as my full time job (for now, hey, I'm young) and I although I sell lots of macs, I have yet to sell any to someone who wanted for "status and show". 90% of them are to people who are sick of putting up with all the ***** of the Windows/PC world and want something that just works.
- AngelBunny, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6and since every mac made (except mac pro and xserve) uses the exact same laptop hardware (for the most part) apple can mass produce 1 product as 10 different products and make a killing in profits.
- jman491, on 10/26/2009, -2/+8... and all of that without a government bailout.
- peestandingup, on 10/26/2009, -17/+23Well, you'd be an idiot to say that Macs arent better quality than most PCs out there. No question, they make good stuff (that looks good too).
But is it worth what they ask? Probably not. - mrshmants, on 10/26/2009, -3/+9It is called "economy of scale" the more of a product you make the cheaper you can produce that product.
- mrBitch, on 10/26/2009, -2/+8@ Antialias, RE: " .. I don't think you've been following the prices then. The cheapest macbook pro used to be 1799, there is one for 1199 now. Macbook itself has stayed at $999 for a few years at least I don't recall it ever being cheaper than $999."
Good points. However, guys like willdelaney have most probably never bothered with the effort of typing in apple.com to find out for himself... - copywriteink, on 10/25/2009, -3/+9How are they doing it? Who purchases the lowest end 'anything' without an upgrade or two?
- BlueStarr, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6he wasn't talking about how many years of coverage but the efficacy and hassle free service.
- roflbrothel, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6Apple does not service ANY computer that's more than a year old without the customer purchasing an extended Applecare warranty for $300 within a year of purchase. The warranty lasts for 3 years. Beyond that 3 years you have to pay for repairs.
I'm not saying I don't like Apple's products but there are a few companies out there that offer similar warranties. Apple does tend to have above average support though. - Apolitik, on 10/26/2009, -2/+8It's only gotten better. I had a PowerBook G4 that I got in 2005. That lasted me 4 years and only saw issues once I dropped it and killed it. The new MacBook Pros are even better construction, better components and cheaper price.
To put all of this into perspective, my PowerBook G4 15" was $2,200 when I got it in 2005. My MacBook Pro is FAR superior in every way and was $1,500.
I don't see any negatives in the trend I'm seeing here. - a2fan, on 10/26/2009, -1/+7@ohreilly -- *****, Apple will mail you a battery, especially if you're under warranty or AppleCare. They might recommend that you take it to the store to have it looked over, but if you've already followed all of the troubleshooting steps, they'll send you a replacement.
- Kerrigore, on 10/26/2009, -0/+6To be fair, that mobile i7 processor only came out a month ago, and lots of brick & mortar stores are only just getting it in now. Apple will probably use something similar in their next MBP revision in January. This is one example of their longer product cycle hurting them, but it simplifies things for consumers for the most part.
- beatfarm, on 10/26/2009, -1/+6as a tech who repairs all models of Mac, yes they have undoubtedly improved the build.
- Kerrigore, on 10/26/2009, -0/+5@Lightstab
"Useless" is a bit strong. My main use for Handbrake is transcoding, not ripping. There's plenty of ripping software available on both platforms. - mrBitch, on 10/26/2009, -3/+8RE: " extortion and fronts. normal apple stuff."
You're confusing Apple with Microsoft. Go look it up. - tristanoneil, on 10/26/2009, -0/+5I absolutely agree with the resale aspect I bought a MacBook over 3 years ago for about 1500 dollars and sold it for over 500 dollars recently you could never sell a 3 year old PC for 500 dollars.
- AngelBunny, on 10/26/2009, -2/+7Why not? The average competing brand often has a lineup in which its lower end machines sell more and those lower end machines often have hardware weaker than that of the lowest end macbook.
Maybe it is the fact that the average consumer who splurges for a mac knows what they want? Or maybe it is the fact that the average consumer of a competing brand wants to pay as little as possible?
(talking laptops to laptops) - OmicronNine, on 10/26/2009, -0/+5<all computer hardware is made in china>
- roflbrothel, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5I'm a mac tech too, I can say that the build quality on the computers has definitely improved. I can't comment on other devices like iPods. I haven't really had any experience with them.
- gargantuan, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5I came in here to see what shining examples of unthinking, ill informed Apple bashing I could find.... I'm not dissapointed.
- Lightstab, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5http://www.flickr.com/photos/pacman3000/3774238138 ...
- roflbrothel, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5While I agree Apple charges a lot and sometimes outright rapes their customers on pricing (*coughRAMcough*), there's truth in the numbers. People buy Apple because they like the products and are willing to pay that price. If they weren't worth it, Apple would not be turning a profit.
- dirtboy, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5Blu-ray on a 1366x768 screen is pretty much a waste if you intend to watch movies.
Also, Apple probably doesn't want to include Blu-ray until they can get past any HDCP compliance that studios demand.
Go with what your gut tells you and who your friends are that can help troubleshoot any issues. If they are PC people, go HP; etc... - FruitFocker, on 10/26/2009, -1/+5My 13" Macbook Pro is the nicest laptop I've ever had my hands on. The build quality of the aluminum unibody is unbelievable. The battery life is the best I've ever seen. I've had about 6 laptops all with extended batteries that stuck out the back of the laptop and none of them even came close to this one. I can't recommend it enough.
- Lightstab, on 10/26/2009, -7/+11PC people are never going to accept this, but here are the facts, as plain as day:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pacman3000/3774238138 ... - KrayzieKyd, on 10/26/2009, -4/+8thank you econ 101, but that only explains 9/10 economic trends.
this one can be explained with the concept of 'making it up in volume' -
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