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See the original image at politico.com

Annie Oakley's Gaffe: Clinton mailer shows non-existent gun

politico.com — Hillary Clinton ’s mailing attacking Barack Obama’s record on guns appears to include a striking visual gaffe. One gun expert said “I find it laughable on its face. It's like a picture of Babe Ruth hitting right-handed.” Another: “What a latte-sipping, Gucci-wearing thing to do.”

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  • cg4et, on 05/05/2008, -15/+89Honest mistake. Maybe they were doing too many shots of Crown Royal at the Hillary HQ?
    • jedreport, on 05/05/2008, -1/+19canadian whiskey! nafta!
    • Malacandra95, on 05/05/2008, -6/+48It's actually a rookie mistake for a graphic designer to make. I do graphics for political campaigns, and ask myself (before flipping an image) whether anything in that image is asymmetrical in appearance or use. Rifles are fairly obvious in that regard.
      • pizzas, on 05/05/2008, -5/+9someone must have requested that the rifle be pointing toward Obama's face ... its what i noticed when i first saw this mailer. real classy a+ photoshop
        • aben9woaha, on 05/05/2008, -1/+7I totally agree. At first I thought no big deal about this...flipped by the graphic designer. But once I noticed that the sniper rifle is pointed at Obama's head, there is simply no other way to do this on a mailer but to flip the image.
          • EtherGnat, on 05/05/2008, -2/+4Even Hillary's graphic designers are flip-floppers.
      • Gerz1219, on 05/05/2008, -3/+25The gun had to be flipped. Mailing addresses typically appear on the lower right hand side of the envelope. As the subject, Obama has to be on the left. And the gun has to be facing Obama, to make him appear weak and at the mercy of the gun (and hence gunowners). If the rifle had been facing the other way, Obama would appear to be staring down the sights, which would indicate the opposite.

        I find it less galling that Hillary chose a rare imported sniper rifle to illustrate her newfound embrace of gunowner rights, so much as that Hillary chose to send out direct mail that subliminally encourages the recipient to shoot Obama in the head.
        • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -0/+14"illustrate her newfound embrace of gunowner rights"

          That's the ridiculous part of this. She is just flat out lying again.
          • Jlaugh, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1I doubt Hillary personally chose the gun model.
        • hempydave, on 05/05/2008, -8/+3Not a sniper rifle.
          I don't know any one in the military that would carry a rifle with a complex,hard to keep clean dirt sensitive, hard to fix, impossible to find parts for ,clumsy 2 trigger set up.
          This is for shooting small animals at very long distances by elite a$$wpie$.
        • MWeather, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Uh, isn't the SP66 the sniper model, not the 66? It doesn't look any more intimidating than any other .308 Win sporting rifle I've seen.
        • MikeFromAmerica, on 05/05/2008, -6/+3To a gun-control advocate, all rifles are "sniper rifles." It makes it sound more menacing.
          • Gerz1219, on 05/05/2008, -1/+8FTA: "The Mauser 66, released in 1966 and no longer manufactured, is a high-end hunting rifle that found military use as a sniper rifle."

            What difference does it make whether it's a sniper rifle, or whether a left-handed model has been produced? It's a gun pointed at Obama's head. One doesn't need to have encyclopedic (or even elementary) knowledge of guns to oppose gun control.
          • MWeather, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1Most popular hunting rifles have a sniper and/or police model.
      • streak, on 05/05/2008, -6/+3I wouldn't presume a mistake here. Instead of an accident, it's far more likely the image was flipped for the envelope and to retain the rifle's menacing appearance. How many will recognize the flip? Probably as many as who take the flip as representing Obama's stance on guns.

        "I can no more disown this gun as disown all of the U.S. military." ;-)
    • sodoh, on 05/05/2008, -3/+43She was probably tired waiting up till 3am every night expecting someone to call.
      • diothar, on 05/05/2008, -5/+2Wish I could digg your comment up twice.
      • streak, on 05/05/2008, -7/+1No, she was just tired of hearing Obama denounce his pastor in the events orchestrated by the Obama campaign last week instead of his confronting real issues. Pity he lost Pennsylvania and therefore had to distance himself more publicly (not privately) from Wright.
    • axelstudios, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Gravity Gun support would get her elected...
  • FiestyPumpkin, on 05/05/2008, -15/+158Still, you may want to use a picture of a gun that Americans would actually use.
    • thcobbs, on 05/05/2008, -2/+11I've used double-set triggers before... they greatly improve accuracy.

      Its kinda like when you see a golfer practice a putt before actually sinking the ball.
      • mxmj, on 05/05/2008, -3/+26Not many of the Americans Hilary is trying to woo use Out of production $2200 German hunting rifles.
      • MacEnvy, on 05/05/2008, -0/+14On my old Hawken muzzleloader, the back trigger sets the front to a hair-trigger after you pull it. Is that how the Mauser works too? Just curious ...
        • thcobbs, on 05/05/2008, -0/+10yes.
        • Kent767, on 05/05/2008, -0/+6I have that gun too, was yours a kit build?
          • MacEnvy, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2Don't know, I bought it from a gun shop used for $85. Might have been a kit - it certainly never worked very well, and I ended up getting an inline CVA Firebolt .45 Mag.
    • TheUngod, on 05/05/2008, -5/+13Just points out that her people don't honestly do any research and would rather make things up.
    • 666dorado, on 05/05/2008, -9/+1like a sawed-off shotgun!
    • pjpark, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5My gun was made in China.
    • SwedishNinja, on 05/05/2008, -0/+8Like a wonderful Bushmaster AR-15... oh wait, that's one of the guns that Hillary thinks is intrinsically "evil" and wants to ban, even though it's more American than apple pie and blowjobs. :(
      • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2Apple pie may be American, but I think blowjobs came into their own in ancient Greece.
        • tippmann1, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Does it really matter who invented the blowjob? seriously?
  • thirdcoastborn, on 05/05/2008, -17/+55like a tek9
    • avengingturnip, on 05/05/2008, -4/+24Like a Remington, model 700, or a Lever action 30-30. You know, rifles that American hunters actually use.
      • Jb611, on 05/05/2008, -11/+5I shoot deer with a tek9
        • avengingturnip, on 05/05/2008, -0/+12Sure you do.
        • thcobbs, on 05/05/2008, -2/+31"I shoot AT deer with a tek9"

          There, fixed that for ya.
        • sleepwalkers, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2I hit deer with my car.
          Does that count?
      • MWeather, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1The Remington 700 looks pretty much the same, and like the Modell 66, it comes in a sniper variant (the M24)
    • Coven, on 05/05/2008, -3/+13Like a reply button...
  • redcolumbine, on 05/05/2008, -11/+76with the reg number filed off.
    • AnarkeIncarnate, on 05/05/2008, -1/+24You mean serial number. Guns do not have to be registered. Thanks for playing.
      • RuffRidr, on 05/05/2008, -4/+8"Guns do not have to be registered."

        ....yet. I'd bet money that it happens in the next 8 years.
      • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Haha, sure it;s the serial number. But it's also in a government database somewhere. Part of the "not gun control" gun control.
    • BlueStarr, on 05/05/2008, -2/+2That's gangster.
  • zenithmbr, on 05/05/2008, -35/+284i hate hillary as much as the next digger, but this is just lame. of all the things we can bash her on, we're going to harp on how some lowly graphic designer in her campaign working for free accidentally flipped a rifle the wrong way?
    • jedreport, on 05/05/2008, -15/+19dude, it's obviously trivia -- but it's funny. nothing to get too serious about!
      • miko555, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1I hope you mean trivial...
        • tippmann1, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2*In 2050

          Teacher: "In the 2008 presidential campaign Hillary Clinton sent out a mailer bashing her opponent on gun control and used a picture of a gun that was flipped over!! Consequently she lost in the biggest landslide in American history."
    • Picaroon, on 05/05/2008, -7/+73Edit->transform->flip horizontal
      He made it fit the mailer better... I really don't see why this matters.
      • sleepycoder, on 05/05/2008, -8/+14Right or wrong, it undermines her position when her own mailing gives gun enthusiasts the feeling that she really doesn't know or care about guns. It's like Hillary saying that she feels the pain of the American people at the pumps, but then admitting that she hadn't pumped her own gas for 20 years. She really needs to do a better job stating her position without adding embellishments that make her seem like a fraud.
        • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -1/+5"mailing gives gun enthusiasts the feeling that she really doesn't know or care about guns."

          There isn't any doubt about that. Neither her, nor her husband, know anything about firearms. I quote her husband to illustrate the point. During his campaign and during the whole push to ban more guns he was talking about how nobody NEEDED more than a few firearms. "Guys I know back in Arkansas have been hunting duck using the same rifle for years." Um, yeah, sure they have Billy. You don't use a rifle to hunt ducks.
          • MWeather, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1You do if they're sitting still.
          • Cerebron, on 05/05/2008, -0/+0The Beverley Hillbillies shoot skeet with rifles too. Don't underestimate the shootin' skills of Arkansawyers.
        • se1zure, on 05/06/2008, -0/+2I can bet that 99% of the people I know with guns (for hunting) wouldn't spot that mistake. Who knows that a specific gun was never created in a left hand model....
      • 666dorado, on 05/05/2008, -4/+3"Edit->transform->flip horizontal"
        that's what she does with her campaign platform
      • Buckweet, on 05/05/2008, -3/+0Hey, Picaroon, I hope you didn't spill your latte on your Guccis when you typed that!
    • EnjoyTheFact, on 05/05/2008, -2/+30Came here to say that, glad to see someone beat me to it.
      • Ivorydrive, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1same here. it's graphic design. people act like hillary was the one who sat down at the computer and made the image herself. all this constant, mindless hillary bashing makes me ***** sick. I don't like her... but my god. diggers are just reaching now. things like this are why I don't think the average american is smart enough to deserve a vote.
    • wrongonce, on 05/05/2008, -17/+4If people working for me make mistakes it makes me look bad. Like it or not, that is the truth, and it should be applied to a president as well. Plus, my assumption is that nothing goes out the door of her campaign without her sign-off. Otherwise you could get into all sorts of mischief by being an unpaid volunteer for Hillary.
      • thcobbs, on 05/05/2008, -1/+6You know what happens when you assume. But more likely is that Hillary signed off on the IDEA of the mailer, but someone ***** up the implementation.
    • Reclinatron, on 05/05/2008, -15/+53Did you even read the article? It isn't even a gun that anyone receiving the mailer would want because of how expensive and European it is. The mailer goes to show how little ANYONE involved with the Clinton campaign knows about guns. This should be of great concern to her campaign as it diminishes her credibility when she is attacking Obama.

      Her mailer was intended to make Obama look bad to gun owners. Instead she makes herself look stupid to a bunch of gun owners.
      • thcobbs, on 05/05/2008, -1/+10She didn't need the mailer to help that view.
        • Cerebron, on 05/05/2008, -1/+1Americans don't mind expensive European guns, H&K, Enfield, Sig Sauer, or even Uzi, just to name a few, are excellent Euro guns that not only are pricey, but most gun lovers would like here in America.
        • azimir, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1I love my Sig, it fits nicely in the case next to my S&W. I'm an equal opportunity gun owner.
      • se1zure, on 05/06/2008, -0/+2You can know alot about guns and still be oblivious to the fact that a left handed model was never made of something. Not to mention that flipping it horizontal in photoshop would be an easy mistake even for a rifle enthusiast.
    • DarthTurducken, on 05/05/2008, -2/+5It was you, wasn't it? Fess up!
    • pintomp3, on 05/05/2008, -1/+28this is a very serious matter. i'm sure she will be asked about it at the next abc debates.
      • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -2/+11if they can fit it in between asking Obama why he hates America
    • ggnictee, on 05/05/2008, -1/+9Thank you. There is already so much nonsense being passed off as important news worthy issues. Trying to save money by making a stock photo work with your mailer isn't as important as the fact that the mailer is overtly deceptive (Clinton and Obama have very similar stances on guns)
      There are so many important things going on. Lets talk about those.
    • hifiDesign, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3Silly, I agree. But Reclinatron has a point — when you're designing, you're supposed to ask questions about target audience and be culturally sensitive to certain aspects elements included in your design. This article is a valid assertion of that precept, and the gaffe **should** be criticized... Just along different lines. It's more of an affront to the design industry in that hackish, chop-shop, "time saving" marketing tactics negatively affecting the effectiveness of a given design (and by extension, the message that is being communicated) should be avoided at all costs.
    • asauterChicago, on 05/05/2008, -2/+5Well, you have to see the original: http://digg.com/politics/This_is_what_the_Clinton_ ... . She was sending out this mailing in rural IN, bashing Obama's stance on guns. Of course, she has strict gun policy views also, so this thing is just ridiculous. The point of this is, that not only is the mailing made to look like she's pro-gun but to make matters more awesome, she used a $2,200 sniper rifle, you can't even buy in the states :-).
      • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -5/+2Actually, you can't buy it anywhere because it doesn't exist. Try reading next time.
        • Frost9999, on 05/05/2008, -0/+4It's a photo of a real gun, and the photo has been flipped horizontally. The gun doesn't suddenly cease to exist when you do this.. I just tried it with a photo of my ex.
        • asauterChicago, on 05/07/2008, -0/+1I'm the one that broke this story, the original mailer was sent to my parents, I scanned it, and submitted it to Digg and Reddit... I'm well aware of the issues with it. You try reading next time.
    • clancyryan, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4The mailer is talking about guns, it has a picture of a gun. Its not like they put a laser rifle on it. If they put an illustration of a 'real' gun from America, would that be more 'real' than a flipped photo of a European gun?
    • charlietuna, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3I'm on board here. I have a Ruger 10/22, and it's a great little rifle, and very very popular. It's like a VW Beetle to gun types, and the customizations can cost several times more than the stock gun. It's also hardly as photogenic as that Mauser.
    • obliviousfool, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3It's not lame for a couple of reasons. She's trying to make herself some sort of gun rights advocate. She isn't. She's been pretending she loves guns. She doesn't. She's attacking Obama on this issue, and I'd bet their positions are actually quite similar. She's only attacking him in this way to rural voters. I'm an urban Hoosier, and I've received two mailers of Hillary's attacking Obama, but I didn't get this one. Gun rights isn't a huge issue here, but she's trying to make it one. To me this shows a lack of respect for rural Hoosiers. She's sent out a flier on an emotional wedge issue. Wedge issues like gay marriage or gun rights are the scum at the bottom of the American political barrel. Using them instead of the top issues of the election is very lame. Aside from all that, she's sent out a flier depicting a gun aimed at Obama's head to people in a state where he's been traveling recently. That is exceedingly lame. These fliers always tend to be extreme, but I'd give this one a big thumbs down.
    • rpdillon, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2The whole point of the mailer is 1) To make Obama seem more liberal than Hillary is on gun control (questionable) and 2) appeal to gun enthusiasts. You're not going to appeal to people by using screwed up imagery of something they know about intimately. Assuming you are from the US, you would probably notice if someone said they were a real fan of the US and put up the US flag flipped horizontally on a mailer (with the blue starfield to the right).
      • yaddayaddayoda, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Or an upside down flag.

        Or sending out a photo of a car with the steering wheel on the wrong side.
    • daizaru, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3Yeah!!!! I mean nobody is bashing Obama for inconsequential things... let's be fair to hilary, she doesn't deserve this!!!!

  • skippyoh, on 05/05/2008, -9/+86damn, I thought this was going to be something that I actually gave two ***** about...
    • Cswltd13, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1yeah, me too. funny how that works. this getting dugg up is reminiscent of the media harping on *****, trivial details about Obama: something which diggers hate, of course.
  • fadeout, on 05/05/2008, -6/+65How dare you doubt the efforts of a sniper dodging war hero!
  • carterbaldwin, on 05/05/2008, -4/+153It's the sniper who fired at Clinton in Bosnia! A left-handed european!
    • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -3/+11I live in europe and happen to be left handed, what of it?
      • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -2/+7I just noticed the smiley didnt make it into my comment, before anyone freaks it was a joke (although true).
      • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -0/+9DUN DUN DUNNNNNN
      • yacks, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5You need to practice your aim more. You were like a whole continent off from hitting her.
    • FuzzyTheDuck, on 05/05/2008, -2/+2Oh, right. A nonexistant, left-handed European sniper in bosnia firing a nonexistant left-handed rifle. I'll believe that.
      • se1zure, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1How is it nonexistant? A digitally flipped photo doesn't make it non existen, it makes it a real gun which has been digitally flipped.
    • epborden, on 05/06/2008, -1/+1lol nice one dude, witty of you!
    • AmnioticEntity, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1jolly good show, sir!
  • brokenspatula, on 05/05/2008, -38/+15THAT'S RIGHT, YOU HAVE GOTTEN HILLARY WITH THIS BOO BOO, CANT VOTE FOR HER NOW
    • h3lx, on 05/05/2008, -3/+10That's exactly what I thought. She can't find competent individuals to produce her goddamn mailers, how can we expect her to find competent individuals to fill her cabinet. We've trusted an idiot for 6 years now and look where where we are... hair of the dog aint going to fix this, "Son, that dog won't hunt."
      • cutething, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4I'll admit, I don't really agree with much less understand your posting, but I'm digging it up because you're clearly fiery about the subject, and your ire amuses me.
        • coyote1284, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5He's suggesting that electing Sen. Clinton would be just as much of a mistake as the last election. "Hair of the dog" is an alcoholic beverage concocted to "cure" a hangover. IOW, a change to the polar opposite direction is just as bad.
          • cutething, on 05/07/2008, -0/+1Thank you, Obviousman. I understand the terminology. I'm not necessarily understanding the logical leap from someone making a mailer to someone in her cabinet.
          • h3lx, on 05/09/2008, -0/+1/cutething: there is no logical leap to be made which makes this whole bit that much more absurd. The art development is far removed from the front lines of the campaign that it teeters on the idiotic to bring up a mundane technicality to a low level piece of art.

            In future posts, I'll try to make a concerted effort to clarify my use of subtle sarcasm. Given the state of the population on Digg, I can now clearly see how someone could have taken me seriously.
    • PoonGnarfler, on 05/05/2008, -1/+17I USE CAPS LOCK BECAUSE ITS LIKE YELLING OVER THE INTERNET!!!
      • rayraym0fucka, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3I DO IT BECAUSE IT MAKES ME LOOK COOL.
        • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2ITS LIKE CRUISE CONTROL!
        • xxMarka, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1I'M JUMPING ON THE BANDWAGON IN HOPES OF BEING DUGG UP
    • dafragsta, on 05/05/2008, -1/+6I don't think anyone seriously discredits her for this, when there are so many actually good rasons to not vote for her.
    • hobophobe, on 05/06/2008, -0/+2Yeah, plus the gun doesn't have a flag pin!
  • mrshickadance9, on 05/05/2008, -17/+40really...who cares.
    • BohicaTwentyTwo, on 05/05/2008, -4/+26The target demograpic of those letters.
      • rjwisniewski, on 05/05/2008, -1/+12Exactly. Avid hunters and sport shooters would pick up on this in an instant. Sure, it was a graphic design "boo-boo" but it was also a rifle we'd never use.
        • MacEnvy, on 05/05/2008, -1/+10Well, I'd use it if I had one. But I'd feel pretty "elitist" carrying a vintage Mauser around the swamp :)
        • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -6/+1Reading comprehension pwned both of you. The rifle doesn't exist. The model pictured was never made in a left handed version.
          • Kyan, on 05/05/2008, -0/+12No, reading comprehension pwnd you. Of course the left-handed one in the flipped picture doesn't exist. That doesn't mean gun enthusiasts can't tell it is a backwards pic of a 2,200 dollar gun that DOES exist.

            Let me ask you this - if you look in the mirror do you see a reflection of yourself or a person who doesn't exist?
  • badassninja, on 05/05/2008, -13/+5What I care about is what direction was her ad pushing? Is it, "oh noes! he's pro guns?" Because if it is then it's called the right to bare arms and so whoever is anti guns is anti liberty and pro police state.... just saying.
    • chicofaraby, on 05/05/2008, -1/+8Some people SHOULD cover their arms. It's only right.
      • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2I mean, have you seen Robin Williams? Talk about Bear Arms!
    • AnarkeIncarnate, on 05/05/2008, -0/+10You should have read the article. She was complaining that Obama was ANTI GUN. She is now saying how much she loves firearms.
    • Ryan166, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3Obama = pro guns? ...even Clinton couldn't make that BS up.
    • Metalcard, on 05/05/2008, -9/+6"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Sounds like you only need guns if your going be in a militia and going protect the country.
      • Nishnabotna, on 05/05/2008, -0/+10You might want to read up on what that passage really means and what that militia is supposed to protect us from.
      • insertAliasHere, on 05/05/2008, -0/+4There are 2 distinct statements in that sentence. One could interpret it as such:

        "Because a well-regulated militia may be and is necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed so they can form said militia in the time of need."

        At least, that's how it scans for me.
        • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3Absolutely. The first phrase just say that a militia is necessary to a free state; it doesnt mean only those in a militia should have the right to bear arms.
          • netant, on 05/06/2008, -1/+1Its IMPLIED that the right of the people to keep and bear arms IS because a WELL-REGULATED militia is necessary for the security of a free state. The Constitution did not put wording, other than the preamble, about its "rationale" for each article.

            Mind you, I consider police to be the same as a well-regulated militia, and conformant to what the founding fathers wanted. And one also needs to realize among the many reasons the Constitution came about was the Articles of Confederation did not address problems like the Whiskey Rebellion. The founding fathers wanted well-regulated militias to protect the locality and the "free" state, not to protect the "right" of unorganized mobs to shoot up the town. And frankly, a gun club chartered to protect the community that answers to a locally elected official satisfies my definition of a well-regulated miliitia. So:

            You belong to the State Guard, police, or a properly chartered gun club, the Federal Gov't nor state can infringe upon your right to keep and bear arms.
            If you're none of the above, the local gov't can infringe away.
          • insertAliasHere, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1Well, luckily, your definition of a well-regulated militia doesn't matter. If it was as obvious as either of us stated, there would be no debate. But it is ambiguous, so here we are.
  • jiqiren, on 05/05/2008, -19/+6Buried... Sick of crap about HRC, Obama, and old-guy-McCain.
    • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Well, that's the 2008 US presidential election. Suck it up or turn off the politics category.
  • doctorfungi, on 05/05/2008, -14/+66You seriously have about 1000 valid criticisms of Hilary Clinton and you choose to exert your effort on this? Don't ramble on about this *****. It means nothing, and reflects worse upon you than it does on Hilary.
    • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2What effort? It's a short little article that was written because people actually notified them about it. It's not like this is a ground-breaking expose years in the making. It's just another thing to add to the pile of 'stuff Hillary did wrong' The pile doesn't need to get bigger, but that's not stopping her from piling it on, so why should we refrain on talking about it?
    • IphtashuFitz, on 05/05/2008, -0/+13Actually it does reflect pretty poorly on Hilary given it's intent. Imagine you're seriously into fly fishing and you get a letter in the mail from Clinton questioning Obamas stance on fly fishing, but the letter has a picture of a person using a deep sea fishing rod in a river or stream. It demonstrates just how clueless she is to the target audience and that she doesn't really know anything about the claims she's making.

      This mailer is likely targeting members of the NRA and other gun groups, and the vast majority of them are going to recognize these serious gaffs in the image. No matter what the letter says the picture alone is going to make people question Clintons credibility on the issue since it proves she is ignorant when it comes to guns. Sure, you can blame it on whatever advertising agency put it together but joe hunter down in Virginia isn't going to think about that. They're going to think about this woman running for president who doesn't know the first thing about guns and gun rights.
    • Ivorydrive, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1according The Onion, "*****" is the most important topic on most voters minds. this article is a perfect example.
  • LiquidIse, on 05/05/2008, -19/+12Buried as both a duplicate and also a pitiful attempt to slam clinton for anything and everything
    • yacks, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2I agree this is pretty lame, but then I am not a gun enthuiast or owner. But anyone with interest in guns and is familiar with this model, it's a bigger deal. This mailer was geared to gun nuts.
  • Shao00, on 05/05/2008, -9/+50As much as I hate HRC, this is a really silly attack.........
    • Jexie, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3Fight fire with fire I guess. It would be perfect poetic justice to see Clinton go down from something so stupid and trivial (though this won't do it, one can always dream).
  • Coven, on 05/05/2008, -7/+3Where's cashman screaming alliterations about those pesky lying leftist liberal lawers graciously grabbing grandma's guns? He must have a day off.
  • BohicaTwentyTwo, on 05/05/2008, -3/+14Rich people, God bless them and their elitist, Crown Royal shooting, don't know their way around the business end of a rifle ways.
  • Dibou, on 05/05/2008, -21/+13Obama supporters are really scraping the bottom of the barrel now.
    • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -3/+1Well, Hillary's already failed at everything else, so yeah, once we call her out on all her ***** there's not a lot of hard-hitting stuff left.
      • sonnybobiche, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1good one.
        • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -2/+3And it's true. She and Obama agree on a lot, so no argument there. Hillary's been called out about how stupid her vote for the war was, how stupid her gas tax holiday idea is, so all that's left is to expose the idiocy that pervades her entire campaign, not just the space between her ears.
          • sonnybobiche, on 05/05/2008, -1/+2Obama's supporters seem to want to do his dirty work for him, by completely eviscerating Clinton in a way that he publicly refuses to.
            The politicians are supposed to be the ones that fight each other, not the people. It seems we've forgotten that.
          • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1You're right, people never fight each other, that's never happened in the history of the world.
  • rjwisniewski, on 05/05/2008, -1/+6This didn't help her gain any support from the NRA base, that's for sure.
  • Mahoney07, on 05/05/2008, -7/+20Why does it matter if the gun was reversed? It's just a picture of a gun. They probably just googled rifle.
    • Duositex, on 05/05/2008, -5/+5Exactly. It's lazy and uninformed. Just like the rest of her campaign attacks on Barack.
    • clancyryan, on 05/05/2008, -1/+5maybe they just realized, correctly, that it didn't matter.
    • lgfaphile, on 05/05/2008, -2/+2No it isn't just "reversed". You have no idea what you are talking about.
  • twtchr44, on 05/05/2008, -7/+9is anyone else getting sick of hillary's ***** slander attacks on barack? seriously, she has no positive points to her, and so the best she can do is just bring him lower than her. i think obama should shoot her with the gun he's pictured with.
    • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3He doesn't need to, she's already using her $2200 non-American rifle to shoot herself in the foot dozens of times.
    • BECoole, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1The more BS attacks on Bastard Obama the better!
    • NSResponder, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1"is anyone else getting sick of hillary's ***** slander attacks on barack? "

      Only a couple million people.

      -jcr
  • asauterChicago, on 05/05/2008, -11/+16Yay!! This is actually hitting the front page (I did submit it, but it never made the front page on Digg). I'm the one who scanned and submitted the flier this weekend. I was at my parents house and found this. You can see the original on my flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/47595300@N00/24614036 ...

    Thanks Internet!!
    • aladrin, on 05/05/2008, -2/+5So how many Internet Theoretical Dollars did you earn from this?

      Wait, don't tell us. Nobody cares.
    • ShiningSquirrel, on 05/05/2008, -1/+6Congrats, you made a story out of nothing, and people saw it.
      I guess i'ts true what they say, small things amuse small minds.
    • alpha88, on 05/05/2008, -4/+2Hoo. Ray.

      I think I accidentally forgot your medal.
    • ligyron, on 05/05/2008, -2/+4Good job. I hope this gave you the confidence in yourself to approach a woman and talk to her some day. Good luck with everything and don't let anybody ever tell you that you can't accomplish something, because you a unique and special individual no matter what anybody tells you!
  • agentVivid, on 05/05/2008, -7/+10getting a bit picky? buried :
  • wrathofg0d, on 05/05/2008, -1/+8Should have used a pic of an AK.
  • EvilDoer, on 05/05/2008, -2/+8You're missing the point, that's the gun the snipers used to shoot at her in Bosnia.
  • colin8651, on 05/05/2008, -2/+16They do know something about rifles. Rifles with a wood stock are good; rifles with a synthetic stock (Black) are bad.

    I could respect the mailer if it had an AR15 on it, but damn libs still don't understand what the second amendment is about.
    • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -0/+6the AR15 would have looked more scary too, basically the definition NJ uses to define assault rifles - if its scary looking its an assault rifle (black plastic instead of faux wood grain for example)
      • colin8651, on 05/05/2008, -2/+5Or the AR15 is powerful (5.56) and dangerous, but a 30.06 hunting rifle is not powerful and safe for the people to have.
        • MacEnvy, on 05/05/2008, -0/+4That's why I only buy my black rifles in .308 - a fine hunting caliber. None of that dangerous high-powered 5.56 metric stuff! Those are for criminals!
          • SuperVepr308, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5I have four black rifles in .308 and man, they are a blast! Nuthin' says lovin' like a .308!
    • veriix, on 05/05/2008, -0/+11But it has two triggers, thats twice the killing power! Only someone with the mentality of "I can never find a trigger fast enough when I'm angry" would have a gun like that.
      • tech42er, on 05/05/2008, -0/+1Evidently, it's a popular modification in Europe.
    • SuperVepr308, on 05/05/2008, -0/+6Evil Black Guns. Good times:)
    • CrackWilding, on 05/05/2008, -4/+1Uh, I don't think it's an anti-gun mailer. If you're dogging Obama for being anti-gun, you want something that looks at least vaguely like a hunting rifle.
  • BoonieHat, on 05/05/2008, -0/+8I don't really care about the political aspect, I just think it's funny when people mirror images without realizing it makes the object in the picture unpossible.
  • gnarbuckets, on 05/05/2008, -1/+20“It’s a $2,200 German import — it’s hardly typical of what the average workingman in Indiana uses,” he said.

    Oh so now we Hoosiers are poor, too? Why's everybody picking on us?

    :)
    • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -4/+0because that movie sucked! :)
      • Pimpalicious316, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3them's fighting words 'round here, partner.
    • BlueStarr, on 05/05/2008, -3/+1It's not even the price but the fact it's not made in America. Would you buy a German rifle over an American one. ;)
      • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2It's not made AT ALL. Left handed 66s don't exist.
  • roguepirate, on 05/05/2008, -0/+17It's Hilary's way of saying how much of an elitist Obama is, he uses left handed European rifles.
    • yacks, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5don't forget that he is so elitest, that he uses left handed European rifles that don't exist. ;)
    • redneckblues, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1Well he is left-handed.
  • Ryan166, on 05/05/2008, -10/+3Gun owners are voting Republican. Why is Clinton even attempting to get their vote? It ain't happening.
    • Klainmeister, on 05/05/2008, -1/+10Erm, I vote democratic and so does my entire extended family......

      ...and we all own guns and are sportsmen. You can have socially progressive ideas and also support the constitution and sportsmen rights at the same time.
    • Digger1218, on 05/05/2008, -1/+5I own guns and almost always vote Democrat. (not a millionaire after all)
    • 11oops, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4I am a registered gun owner. I am a registered democrat. You are an embarrassment to the human race.
    • Ryan166, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1Then you guys are not sportsMEN. Real sportsMEN vote to keep their guns, and not for gay marriage and high taxes.
  • giantsfan134, on 05/05/2008, -6/+6This is a pathetic attack honestly. I was hoping on something that I could actually use against Hillary supporters, but somehow "The gun she used in one of her ads is actually a mirror image of a real gun so it doesn't actually exist which must mean that she is anti-guns!" doesn't work out to a logical argument.
    • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -2/+2The argument wasn't trying to say that because of this flier she is anti-guns. It's saying that she hires idiots to do her mailer design and that she and her staff don't realize that the majority of gunowners in Indiana probably don't prefer left-handed IMPORTS that cost $2200. The point is that Hillary is busy claiming Obama is an elitist while sitting on her throne sipping Crown Royal and not giving two ***** about the people whose votes she's trying to get.
    • CeeAyy, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3You are missing the point. She is representing herself as someone who is pro guns yet is completely out of touch with the demographic that she is trying to pander to with that mailer.

      If you RTA you would know that it is a high end european gun that is no longer in production, besides the fact that the image is reversed. If her target audience is middle class hunting enthusiasts or anyone who is interested in gun ownership issues, she is missing the mark. That's like professing your love for your better half and using the wrong name. Let me see how that works out for you! lol. It may not matter to everyone else, but the target audience is sure to be unhappy with your attempt.
      • Kyan, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2"...she is missing the mark."
        Now, that was apt.
  • vogelshock, on 05/05/2008, -10/+1I still don't understand... you can't "mirror flip" the image that way because the bolt is on the other side of the gun. No matter which way the barrel points... the bolt would still be on the correct side.
    • MEMADDOG, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5negative.
    • MerryMortician, on 05/05/2008, -0/+8/facepalm

      dude.. right click the photo hit save as.. then open it up with Paint. then select it and invert the photo horizontally. you will understand.



      maybe.




      dont wanna give you too much credit.
    • Kyan, on 05/05/2008, -1/+2Damn, I wish I could do that with some pics of high-security buildings. just take a pic of the outside, flip it in photoshop and voila! A pic of the inside of the building!
    • jsauter, on 05/05/2008, -0/+3You don't use mirrors much, do you?
  • p51d007, on 05/05/2008, -9/+2You expect liberals to know what a gun looks like? Hell, if they even picked one up, they would be lucky to know which way to point it!
    • pjenz25, on 05/06/2008, -0/+0Of course I'd know where to point it...right at the face of my hunting partner.
  • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -2/+13What is funnier is that Bill Clinton in Feburary 2000 commissioned a study that showed that being anti-gun increases violent crime. Well the point was to prove the opposite, its just that the facts did not support that conclusion, they instead proved the opposite. With that study the DNC dropped just a month or so later the anti-gun requirement to be nominated.

    So what I am saying is that hillary wouldnt have had to send out that mailing if her husband didnt let out the dirty little secret "criminals dont want to rob or rape someone if they think they might get shot".

    /bill is the husband right? I didnt get that backwards?
  • JMellissa, on 05/05/2008, -2/+3Hillary can go ***** in her hat while I clean my guns and reload the ammo!
  • Hetman, on 05/05/2008, -2/+12The point is both of them are anti-gun and they only say that they are pro gun when the situation arises. Like all politicians. I personally like my second amendment and I hate when senators and congressman vote against constitutional rights.
    • elipabst, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2Obama hasn't really initiated any attacks on her regarding gun control, he's just pointed out the blatant hypocracy in her attacks against him (like the Annie Oakley comment). If anything she has a much worse record than him on supporting 2nd amendment rights. She was one of one 16 Senators who voted *FOR* the Vitter ammendemnt that would allow the gov't to seize lawfully owned weapons in times of a major disaster. Obama voted against it. Don't get me wrong, Obama is no 2nd amendment crusader, but it's utterly absurd to watch her parade around and pretend like she supports gun rights.
  • MEMADDOG, on 05/05/2008, -4/+10As a graphic designer, I would totally flip an image for aesthetic reasons - I have numerous times. The ad isn't for the gun model so there isn't a great reason to present it authentically. The only reason anyone should care would be due to the target audience - those that have a gun interest. Guess what, the candidates headshots and other materials are no doubt Photoshopped for retouching. Oh no!
    • Mejari, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2Wait, so the only reason someone should care is if it would affect the target audience. You realize you're talking about Hillary's mailer to Indiana talking about how anti-gun Obama is right? So wouldn't the target of this mailer be people who are pro-gun? So shouldn't you realize that people who are pro-gun might know a little something about guns? So shouldn't you do your best not to look like a complete tool to the people whose votes you're trying to get?
    • IphtashuFitz, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5True, but especially when it comes to targeted political ads I think you really need to consider the audience. If I was a gun owner living in rural Virginia and I got this mailer I certainly wouldn't think "Gee, they just photoshopped this to make it more appealing". I'd likely think "What an idiot for using an obviously fake image of a gun that neither I nor any of my friends/family could ever afford. Whey didn't they just use a picture of a Remington 700, and photograph it the right way so that it looks right in the picture?" This mailing has likely become a huge joke among gun enthusiasts and could very well cause some of them to start questioning Clinton as a reliable and honest person. That's not a good thing as far as the Clinton camp goes.
    • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4Your second sentence makes your first invalid. It should read, "As a bad graphic designer,...."
    • clancyryan, on 05/05/2008, -1/+0Exactly, they probably considered looking for a photo that fit on the envelope better for about 1/8 of a second before just flipping it and saving lots of effort. How could anyone read so much into this?
  • Kohaxx, on 05/05/2008, -3/+9Looks like in trying to appeal to gun-owners, she shot herself in the foot.
  • 666dorado, on 05/05/2008, -6/+11it's actually pretty relevant, basically she's getting called out for being a poser.
  • 55mph, on 05/05/2008, -5/+2Her peeps can't get anything right. Somebody kick this bitch, HARD!
  • lgfaphile, on 05/05/2008, -3/+12the not so funny thing about gun ban advocates like Hillary (and Barry O for that matter) is that they are completely cavalier about trampling our Second Amendment rights, while, at the same time, they are completely ignorant about firearms.
  • Farceur318, on 05/05/2008, -4/+1I prefer Obama as much as any of you, but are we really sitting here making fun of Hillary's photo shop skills? That seems kind of petty to me. I mean, you guys do realize that she didn't even personally make that image, right?
  • BlueStarr, on 05/05/2008, -3/+1The gun that's used by elitist and out of touch politicians alike. LOL
  • warispeace21, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4Honest question - What is the point of having a double-trigger?
    • Zamslam, on 05/05/2008, -6/+4It's for shooting at things you hate. One trigger limits the satisfaction..
    • Trigonometron, on 05/05/2008, -2/+22Double triggers are used to increase accuracy. The first trigger is slightly hard to pull, and unlocks the 2nd trigger. The 2nd trigger is set very light, a very slight pull will make it go off. Shooters generally like light triggers, so that pulling it doesn't throw off aim.
      ::Begins getting dugg down for knowing something about a firearm.::
      • Kyan, on 05/05/2008, -3/+3OH noes! there's that damned reverse psychology again. I have to digg you up. You got me.
      • saisumimen, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2":Begins getting dugg down for knowing something about a firearm.::"

        Get over yourself. You were doing so well until that sentence.
    • cawpin, on 05/05/2008, -0/+7It's a double set trigger. You use one to "set" the other, usually the front "sets" the rear. The second trigger has a VERY light pull to make it easier to make accurate shots. There are also single set triggers, which are more common.
      • hempydave, on 05/05/2008, -3/+1"there are also single set triggers"
        witch snipers really use.
        • azimir, on 05/05/2008, -0/+5Snipers who shoot witches? I'd like to see that training program.
        • utahnkid, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1Haha oh man.. How did you mess up making fun of someone?? He just led us to believe there are "witch snipers".. Not that they shoot them, I'm not sure how you even got that out of it.
        • hempydave, on 05/19/2008, -0/+1Spell check FTLose I guess
    • RuffRidr, on 05/05/2008, -0/+4It's an assault trigger. The Dems are going to reinstate the Assault Weapons Ban and add these and "shoulder things that go up" to the forbidden items list.
      • normalkid0615, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1assault weapons killed a Philadelphia officer over the weekend. Hurray Second Amendment!
        • RuffRidr, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1The officer would have been no less dead if it was a hunting rifle.
    • normalkid0615, on 05/05/2008, -8/+4assault weapons killed a Philadelphia officer over the weekend. Hurray Second Amendment!
      • sw33tsarin, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3Really? Was the Assault weapon obtained legally?
      • rogersj3, on 05/05/2008, -1/+4Really? It pulled its own trigger and everything?
      • REDBLIND, on 05/05/2008, -0/+2And how many people did knock-off 9mm pistols kill yesterday? I'm all for gun control, but targeting assault weapons will not achieve anything. The thugs in nearby Oakland aren't toting M16s and AK47s. More like cheapo imported pistols bought out of some dude's trunk in a McDonald's parking lot off East 14th.
  • republicker, on 05/05/2008, -4/+5Gun rights are not even an issue. The politicians will never take our guns, not only because a civil war will ensue but because they know one of the 80 million gun owners might live next door. If you can get the knee slap votes of the average American ***** then you can win the election. oh ones the evil bad black man is gonna taker guns!!!!
    • Hetman, on 05/05/2008, -0/+9The problem I have is. When they enact laws like Chicago where it is against the law to own a gun. In any fashion. The problem is obvious people who shoot people hardly ever to it with registered guns. Two weeks ago we had a weekend where 23 people were shot. The peopel who committed these crimes were not using registered guns. Yet I as a law abiding citizen do not have the right to carry one. It is really insane, that we live in a society where it is easier for criminals to get guns that law abiding citizens.
      • RuffRidr, on 05/05/2008, -0/+6The lesson here is that "gun control" is actually more about "control" than it is about "guns".
  • mrgreg, on 05/05/2008, -1/+16Arguing who has the most pro-2nd Amendment stances between Clinton and Obama is like deciding between what method you would want them banned, as there's no good out of it. Both of them are anti-gunners to the extreme, and will never get my vote for that.
    • SuperVepr308, on 05/05/2008, -2/+8Amen.
    • flossdaily, on 05/05/2008, -7/+2Anti-gun to the extreme? *****. complete *****. Listen to what they have actually said and its clear that, although they don't think AK-47s have any place on the streets on New York City, they both respect the second amendment.

      Keep your Fox News propaganda to yourself.
      • Hetman, on 05/05/2008, -2/+5It is against the law to carry any type of gun in downtown Chicago and New York. The laws are already in place. I live downtown chicaog, if I am caught with a hand gun in my apartment it is a felony even if it registered. That is breaking the second amendment. Get your facts straight. It is the same with Washing D.C. but they are currently trying to change the law.
        • flossdaily, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3You're confusing state and local governments with the federal government.
          • mrgreg, on 05/05/2008, -1/+3So you're telling me that you believe that state governments should have the right to supercede the federal Bill of Rights? What if Alabama decided to take away our right to free speech?
          • flossdaily, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1#1) That wasn't my claim at all. Work on your reading comprehension.

            #2) That's really up to the Supreme Court.
        • Hetman, on 05/05/2008, -2/+4Obama did vote to keep guns out of chicago. So that does affect me. And if I lived in New York Hillary would have voted to pass the same law in New York. So regardless if it is federal or local both of them have still affected me with their voting records.
      • mrgreg, on 05/05/2008, -1/+6Fox News Propaganda? Hardly.

        The 2nd Amendment allows an uninfringed right to keep and bear arms. Banning them in a certain city or state is an infringement of that right. Why do you support citizens having more rights in one part of the country, and less than others? I thought the Bill of Rights applied to all citizens.

        I understand better background checks, a waiting period, etc, because those are sensible, respectable steps to get a firearm that do not infringe the people as a whole, but, if a discrepancy is found, infringes the person. Passing a ban that infringes the PEOPLE as a whole is a violation of the 2nd Amendment, and I hope the US Supreme Court agrees with me in its decision in DC Vs Heller this summer.
        • flossdaily, on 05/05/2008, -3/+1Why is that people who cite the second amendment always leave out the first part: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."?
          • mrgreg, on 05/06/2008, -0/+3Why do people who bring that up always leave out the definition of militia, as per US Code?

            http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode10/us ...

            "The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard."
          • flossdaily, on 05/06/2008, -3/+1perhaps because the US code didn't exist when the the bill of rights was drafted?/
          • mrgreg, on 05/06/2008, -1/+2And you don't think the militia was composed of the same people then as was noted in that section of the US Code? Have any proof?
          • flossdaily, on 05/06/2008, -0/+1Yeah, look at the ages of the folks that fought in the revolutionary war. Specifically look at the makeup of massachusetts' militia, which was fighting the British before the continental army got into the fray. Your definition certainly didn't apply to them. Their idea of a militia was any able bodied man who could help.
          • mrgreg, on 05/07/2008, -0/+1...doesn't the US Code say "All able-bodied men?" I think it certainly does apply to them, and can't see why you don't think so.
    • snookky, on 05/05/2008, -1/+1Amen brother!
  • YodaJones, on 05/05/2008, -4/+3Looks like they wanted to make sure the gun was pointed at Obama.
  • DjArcadian, on 05/05/2008, -4/+6This is a non-issue. It's reversed simply because the graphic designer found it more suitable for framing on the envelope in question. I do stuff like this all the time.
  • fani, on 05/05/2008, -1/+19"Where does Barack Obama really stand on guns"....
    See, thats what Hillary doesn't understand. You don't STAND on the gun. You hold it steady and firm in your hand to fire it. What an ignorant bitch.
  • trixterIreland, on 05/05/2008, -1/+11for the anti-gun crowd, could you give me some examples where a criminal said "hey wait man that is illegal I am a criminal and all but I am not gonna do nothin' illegal"

    There are however stories like one just this week where a criminal came into a store, was abusive to staff, they asked him to leave, he pulled out a gun and started shooting. The employees got their guns but never fired a single round, they instead were able to successfully get him to leave the store and no longer put customers or the employees lives in danger. It was on fark, I dont have a link handy, but it was this week.

    • gavin422, on 05/05/2008, -1/+1Honest question: I can't make heads or tails of the first part of your statement. Clarify please?
    • lgfaphile, on 05/05/2008, -2/+1Honest explanation, anti-gunners like Hillary and Barry O know nothing about firearms, but that doesn't stop them from trampling all over our Second Amendment rights. Its a lefty thing...only support those provisions of the Bill of Rights that you agree with.
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